The South Pacific Army

[Hileville]

For proposing the structure/duties of the Army.I have a proposal I will submit on this tomorrow when I am finished. If anyone else has ideas please post it here.My basic proposal will set the Delegate as Commander-in-chief of the Army as he/she will have the final call on most operations. It also establishes the Minister of Security as the General-in-chief of the Army who has the duty of running the Army. I will post the full thing later though.

[Antariel]

Sounds good so far.

[LadyRebels]

Blast from the Past much?The Delegate was Commander/General of the TSP Troops way back.Man I must have missed a lot in three years.......*wanders out with :coffee: in hand*

[Belschaft]

I'm not sure I really see the point of this proposal. What it in effect represents is a transference of duties away from the MoS to the Deleagate, but I can't really see any reasons to do so, though I can immediately think of one big reason not too; the Delegate cannot participate in SPA Operations, and therefore giving him operation control makes no sense. Having the Delegate as a formal/ceremonial Commander in Chief makes sense - the Delegate is our nominal Head of State as well as Head of Government - but leave operational control with the MoS, who can actually use it.

[Antariel]

But the delegate needs to have the final call, and rather than have a Cabinet vote, which can and does take days, surely giving the Delegate control on a time-critical issue like army action is necessary?

[Belschaft]

Or we could leave executive control in the hands of the MoS?

[Antariel]

Yet the delegate is much more active in theory; and surely needs exec control for emregencies?

[Hileville]

I would personally prefer that the Delegate has the final call as he/she is our head of state and should have the final call on operations. It is the Delegate that is responsible for overseeing all ministries and often will get blamed for something out of their control.

[Haxstree]

I agree with Hileville. Supporting an MoS without Delegate oversight or final command makes no sense to me.

[Southern Bellz]

I think it might be time to consider making the Army head NOT an elected position. Maybe like the United States where the delegate is commander and chief, and the army has its own separate rules and regulations.I think that would help the Army actually take off, and now that it has some steam, I think it is a good time to help foster the Army's growth. I think we can agree that the goals of The South Pacific army is to:1) Defend Ourselves2) Support our alliesI reject both classical raiding and defending for this region. It simply makes no sense.Instead we should look to where we can come in as a sign of friendship and support, to come when asked. To offer help, first and see if it is wanted, then move to help our friends.By having this position be democratically elected, I find that some MoS's just wind up with their hands tied and caught in the middle.I agree they need to be held democratically accountable, but I feel that the delegate oversight would be democratic accountability.

[Southern Bellz]

To summarize, make army general a non elected position held accountable by Delegate.

[Haxstree]

To summarize, make army general a non elected position held accountable by Delegate.

I don't agree with this.

In the actual army the ranks are

Delegate (Commander in Chief)
MoS
Deputy MoS
General in Chief
(and so on...)

With General in Chief given very broad powers, almost equal to the MoS but not being an elected position, rather a merit position for army service.

I believe that is the way to do it. There should be some responsible directly for the army that is elected, not simply the delegate. The MoS can remain elected while still having a constant of army generals and experience.

[Antariel]

I think we can elect an army head but still have them responsible to the delegacy.

[LadyRebels]

Until we can get enough people here on these forums and active why not leave it in the capable hands of the MoS and Delegate? just wondering.

[Eluvatar]

Until we can get enough people here on these forums and active why not leave it in the capable hands of the MoS and Delegate? just wondering.

Sounds reasonable to me!

[Hileville]

Okay so how about thiselegate - Final Say on all operationsMoS - Responsible for running the ArmyGeneral of the Army - Obtained by gaining experience through operations - only 1ColonelMajorCaptainPrivateWith this we could also add that if a state of war can only be issued by the Assembly.

[Sheepa]

I agree that the Delegate must have the final say, but the command of the SPA must remain with the MoS. The Delegate shouldn't be able to go over the MoS's head, but I do support a stronger cooperative command structure that can best serve TSP, which includes semi-autonomy within set command guidelines.

[Mahaj]

Your ranks... are so boring. They should be spiced up.

[Haxstree]

Your ranks... are so boring. They should be spiced up.

NO YOU!

[Hileville]

Your ranks... are so boring. They should be spiced up.

Well spice them up then.

[Belschaft]

<blockquote class='ipsBlockquote' > Your ranks... are so boring. They should be spiced up.

Well spice them up then.
</blockquote> I had a cooler rank structure, and awesome rank badges

[Haxstree]

I had a cooler rank structure, and awesome rank badges

And no army... :eyes:

[Southern Bellz]

Haxtree why do you keep being snippy to Bels? Please just let it rest.

[Sheepa]

<blockquote class='ipsBlockquote' > <blockquote class='ipsBlockquote' > Your ranks... are so boring. They should be spiced up.

Well spice them up then.
</blockquote>I had a cooler rank structure, and awesome rank badges
</blockquote> The Badges are nice. We wouldn't mind using them, or something similar.

I think our Rank Structure could benefit from some unique titles for jobs dealing with recruitment and intelligence. They could be supplementary titles on top of the rank system.

[Haxstree]

That shouldn't be in law though.I think beyondMoSDeputyTop Merit General Dudethe MoS should have the liberty to create ranks as he sees fit. If we define all the ranks in law then he'd have to go to the Assembly for any change, which wouldn't be good as it would slow down the Army.I'd just define the top 3 and give the MoS the power to independently create subservient or ancillary ranks.