Days of voting

[Tsrill]

I admit I am a bit out of touch with the laws recently*, but back in the days we used to have votings running from friday to monday or something to that extent, to have both week days and weekends in there. Some folks might only be able to do NS stuff during the weekends, for others it could be easier during the week, depending on everyone's personal situation. Therefore I propose to have, for the next elections, a voting period from thursday to sunday or friday to monday or saturday to tuesday or something to that extent. This to maximize voting opportunity for everyone.

[Escade]

having the full week (Monday to sunday) might be a good idea too.

[Sandaoguo]

I can see where you're coming from. It might be a pretty good idea to have an even balance of weekdays and weekends for voting. Right now elections are simply anchored to April 1st, August 1st and December 1st. Changing it over to where actual voting are spread evenly on weekdays and weekends means we can't specify certain dates anymore.

 

I think the easiest way to go about this would be to have an Election Commission choose the election dates following a guideline that centers voting days where we want them, but doesn't stray too far away from the first of the month. Otherwise, we can come up with an algorithm that does the same thing, but that may be more complicated than going with the human approach. Off the top of my head, a possible algorithm might be:

1. Start at the first of the month.
   
2. Account for the five day nomination period.
   
3. If that results in voting days being spread across weekdays and weekends, then OK.
   
4. If not, move the start position forward one day.
   
5. Repeat until step 3 is satisfied.
   

[Southern Bellz]

I believe that we need to change a lot about the election process timing:

 

I feel like there is too much of an advantage to self nominate and start campaigning, because as soon as nominations closes polls open up.  I feel like there needs to be a week in between to campaign, debate, soak in what the other people are saying and respond to it.

 

I feel that it should go the following:

 

Days 1-5: Nominations and Citizenship Drive

Days 6-10: Closing of citizen aplications/nominations and campaigning period

Days 11-17: Polls Open

[HEM]

Personally, I think a week of voting is a bit too long.

[Kris Kringle]

I agree that we should have time for campaigns. It is a little confusing to have to hear to all the ideas of candidates without knowing for sure if no one else will enter the race, and we as voters sure could use some time to think about our options without having to cast our votes right now.

[Rebel-topia]

If someone accepts their nomination, and doesn't post a campaign, do you really think they're in it to win it?

[Kris Kringle]

Still I think campaigning should only start after nominations are over. Perhaps campaign topics should only start after the end of nominations, so that we can ask questions to all candidates equally and have a reasonable time for all of them to answer.

[Tsrill]

Instead of anchoring to the 1st day of a month, you could maybe anchor it to the first Friday (or whatever day) of the month. I agree that a week of voting is a bit long.

As for splitting nominations and campaigning...on the one hand it could help reduce advantage for early deciders, on the other hand it stretches out the voting period, maybe by too much. I think we should be doing more in this region than just having elections

[Southern Bellz]

If someone accepts their nomination, and doesn't post a campaign, do you really think they're in it to win it?

I think people should be able to campaign as soon as they accept their nomination, but right now there is too big of an advantage for accepting your nomination early.



I think a campaign period would balance that out.



Sent from my DROID RAZR using Tapatalk 4

[Rebel-topia]

Unless you have 3 stages for elections - noms/accepts, campaigning, voting - there's really no way to fix this. And, I'm with Tsrill on this... That's going to be a long election period...

[Escade]

The reason I suggested a week is because some TSPers only check in on weekdays while others are active largely on weekends.  Either way the delegate should send out a TG to the entire region a week before the cutoff date for new citizens with important election dates:

 

- the date to register for citizenship to be able to vote\participate

- the dates nominations will begin and close

- the dates voting will begin and close

 

an extended voting period allows debates between candidates to be schedules or "RMB visits."

[HEM]

An extended voting period kills activity and destroys a week of potential governing. A longer campaign period that encourages debate and allows the whole region to know and understand it is election time makes much more sense.

[Sandaoguo]

Instead of anchoring to the 1st day of a month, you could maybe anchor it to the first Friday (or whatever day) of the month. I agree that a week of voting is a bit long.


As for splitting nominations and campaigning...on the one hand it could help reduce advantage for early deciders, on the other hand it stretches out the voting period, maybe by too much. I think we should be doing more in this region than just having elections

 

The only reason I didn't suggest anchoring election days to the first Friday was because that could fall as much as a week before and a week after cabinet terms end.

[Rebel-topia]

The term doesn't end until the day after elections end (that being when admin/EC can certify the results and the admin team can mask the new cabinet. Up until that happens, the person in charge of a cabinet post is still legally a cabinet member...


I very much liked when nominations started on the first Saturday and voting began that Thursday...

[Sandaoguo]

Constitutionally, the term ends once four months has passed. Maintaining Cabinet authority past then is merely a courtesy of the Assembly, because the Elections Law doesn't specify that voting must occur on the first day of the new term -- just commencement of the elections. Ideally, elections would be finished so that newly-elected Cabinet members can start on the first day of the term.

[Rebel-topia]

The Charter doesn't state that terms start on any specific date, just that they are 4-month terms. With elections starting on the 1st, and voting ending on the 8th, the terms always start and end roughly on the 8th (seeing as maskings don't always get done the MOMENT elections are over).

[Southern Bellz]

If we shorten every period to 5 days, it takes two weeks to hold elections.

[Sandaoguo]

The Charter doesn't state that terms start on any specific date, just that they are 4-month terms. With elections starting on the 1st, and voting ending on the 8th, the terms always start and end roughly on the 8th (seeing as maskings don't always get done the MOMENT elections are over).

 

If a Cabinet member is elected in August, then their term ends on December. That what a four month term means, in my opinion, and that seems to be supported by the Code of Laws. I'm not proposing that we have any period where Cabinet members don't have the authority of their portfolios. I'm simply recognizing that any authority extended past a four month term is a courtesy from the Assembly, one that can be ended at any time. To that extent, the Assembly shouldn't put in place a system that can extend or abridge the length of time a Cabinet member is in office by a week. Thus, the idea of anchoring elections to some first week day doesn't get my support.

 

I think SB's proposed schedule is a good idea, though a week of voting does seem excessive. I also think it's a good idea to give some guideline to an Election Commission that will allow them to choose a date for voting that spreads voting across weekdays and weekends, while not straying too far from the first of the month. For instance, I think the current voting period probably should have been August 1st-4th (or 5th), which would have been Thursday through Sunday/Monday. If the month started on a Monday, I think the optimum voting period would be from the previous Wednesday or Thursday, because we should strive for terms to start as close to the first of the month as possible.

[HEM]

My proposal:

 

3 days exclusively for nominations

7 days for campaigning (nominations can still be made, but campaigning can start instantly)

3 days for voting.

[Rebel-topia]

 

<blockquote class="ipsBlockquote" data-author="Rebel-topia" data-cid="104265" data-time="1375915410">
The Charter doesn't state that terms start on any specific date, just that they are 4-month terms. With elections starting on the 1st, and voting ending on the 8th, the terms always start and end roughly on the 8th (seeing as maskings don't always get done the MOMENT elections are over).

 

If a Cabinet member is elected in August, then their term ends on December. That what a four month term means, in my opinion, and that seems to be supported by the Code of Laws. I'm not proposing that we have any period where Cabinet members don't have the authority of their portfolios. I'm simply recognizing that any authority extended past a four month term is a courtesy from the Assembly, one that can be ended at any time. To that extent, the Assembly shouldn't put in place a system that can extend or abridge the length of time a Cabinet member is in office by a week. Thus, the idea of anchoring elections to some first week day doesn't get my support.

 


</blockquote>
 

The charter states 4 month terms. August 8th to December 8th = 4 months, does it not? Its all dependent on Article I of the CoL. The Charter does NOT specify when elections are, or, to that matter, when the cabinets term starts. Just that service in the cabinet is a 4 month term. The CoL states the conditions of the election process - noting that elections start on the 1st (of April, August, and December), and (unless a run-off is needed) end on the 8th. Therefore, its assumed that the term for the newly elected cabinet positions start on the 8th, ending the 4-month term of the formerly elected cabinet. No courtesy from the Assembly needed.

 

 

I'm not against adding time to the nomination/campaign period. But what I am against is not allowing campaigning immediately after one accepts their nomination. If I'm prepared to run for a position, then I shouldnt be "penalized" for being prepared and accepting a nom/self-declaring.

[Sandaoguo]

I don't think it's necessary to separate nominations and campaigning. I think the nominating and campaigning period needs to be a bit longer sometimes, especially during times of declining activity. We didn't even get around to having a delegate debate this election cycle.

Based on the dynamic nature of activity, I think it's best that we don't codify specific dates for elections. I still suggest we leave it up to the election commission to decide the procedures. If we need oversight of that process, then the Assembly could vote on the EC's proposed procedures prior to each election season.

The charter states 4 month terms. August 8th to December 8th = 4 months, does it not? Its all dependent on Article I of the CoL.

The Code of Laws provides that elections happen on the first day of every April, August and December. That, to me, means that the terms end on the first day of every April, August and December. Neither the Charter nor the Code of Laws explicitly states when terms start and end, so we can have a legitimate disagreement over this. That's why I'm saying it's a courtesy of the Assembly that a Cabinet member remains in office past the first of April, August or December. It's a courtesy because the Assembly hasn't decided to make it a matter of law. Cabinet members certainly don't get to decide when their terms start and end, regardless.

[Rebel-topia]

Just because the election process starts doesnt mean thats when the term for the formerly elected official ends. To say that the Charter saying "The Cabinet will serve a term lasting four months" means the term ends the last day of any month is silly.

 

I propose that the election process begins the 2nd Friday in March, July, and November, and have 7 days for nominations & campaigning, and 3 days for voting. Terms of office start the 1st of April, August, and December, respectfully. That way, there is time for a delegate runoff if needed, and a specific term start/end.

[Sandaoguo]

Just because the election process starts doesnt mean thats when the term for the formerly elected official ends. To say that the Charter saying "The Cabinet will serve a term lasting four months" means the term ends the last day of any month is silly.

The Charter says the term is four months and that the Assembly must determine the procedures for Cabinet elections. I don't think it's at all "silly" to think that terms end on the first day of every April, August and December. Those are the days the Assembly voted on pursuant to its responsibility to determine the procedures for Cabinet elections.


I don't think your view is silly, either. I think the law is ambiguous. In my opinion, in any case of legal ambiguity, continuing to exercise authority is a courtesy of the Assembly, because they haven't cleared up the ambiguity. At any point the Assembly can say when terms start and end, and the Cabinet will follow that determination.


I don't know why you're taking such offense to this. I'm not saying your wrong. I'm saying there's not an absolutely correct answer.

 

I propose that the election process begins the 2nd Friday in March, July, and November, and have 7 days for nominations & campaigning, and 3 days for voting. Terms of office start the 1st of April, August, and December, respectfully. That way, there is time for a delegate runoff if needed, and a specific term start/end.

It doesn't seem like a good idea to anchor the start of an election cycle to anything, in my opinion. I don't see a need to specify that there are X days for nominations or campaigns, because activity is the best determination of how long those periods should be, not the calendar. If the Assembly does choose to anchor elections to any particular day, I would strongly prefer that they choose to anchor elections the actual voting days.

[Rebel-topia]

 

<blockquote class="ipsBlockquote" data-author="Rebel-topia" data-cid="104290" data-time="1376001450">
Just because the election process starts doesnt mean thats when the term for the formerly elected official ends. To say that the Charter saying "The Cabinet will serve a term lasting four months" means the term ends the last day of any month is silly.

The Charter says the term is four months and that the Assembly must determine the procedures for Cabinet elections. I don't think it's at all "silly" to think that terms end on the first day of every April, August and December. Those are the days the Assembly voted on pursuant to its responsibility to determine the procedures for Cabinet elections.


</blockquote>
 

The Assembly passed the CoL stating ELECTIONS start on the 1st of the month. Not that the CABINET TERMS start on the 1st of the month. It doesnt make sense that the term ends before a new minister can be elected.

 

And it really doesnt do us any good to legalize every little thing. Theres no need to be so anally specific in our laws. (thats not a shot at you, but to the region as a whole)